RIFF030 - Sepultura - Beneath the Remains

The End

Riffology

He went James Hetfield again

That was dead good

I was going to say last week

But we didn't do anything last week

No, I loved it

You made that image

No Riffology this week

Because Chris and Neil

Can't get that act together

I know

To be fair

We've done so well

We have done amazingly well

We

Doing this weekly

I noticed most podcasts

Will do like a monthly

Yeah, yeah

Or, you know

Monthly-ish

Yeah

I think we do really well

I think

I think we

The same sort of personalities

That you and I both have

I would say

This is actually a miracle

That we've actually

Managed to do it weekly

I forget to do things

And it's not

It's like

It's like a squirrel, isn't it?

Do you know what I mean?

You know, you get that

Oh, something's happening

And you go and focus on that thing

Yeah, yeah, yeah

And I can't multitask

And then you forgot

Where you buried your nuts

Yeah, I can't multitask at all

My kids think it's hysterical

I can't

Well, I mean, I can

But I do

Like

There's this brilliant study

Which suggested

If you multitask

You do

Like both things

But you do them at like half

You flip them

Yeah, like half the performance

I'm like

If I do two things

I'm like down at 10%

I can't do either

And it feels like

I'm being electrocuted

In the brain

I can't

It doesn't

You know, it's really weird

But my kids think it's hysterical

When

If I'm trying

Like if I'm trying to read

And they come along

And they want something

Yeah

And like I can't

It's not possible

Yeah, it's not

And even if I'm thinking about something

Like if I've got an idea

And I'm trying to focus on that idea

And this one's like

What do you want for tea?

You're like

No, I don't want to talk

I'm doing the thing

Yeah, look, I can't

It's like I can't

I can't do that

I'm doing

I'm doing this thing instead

Yeah, yeah, yeah

There's two things I heard this week

One relates to that

Yeah

Which is

Being an adult

Is just basically asking each other

What you want for dinner

Forever

Yeah, both of you go

I don't know

Yeah, yeah

And then the second one is

Being an adult

Is

Saying

Oh, it's alright

It'll calm down in a couple of weeks

Yeah

It's always that, isn't it?

The thing is

When it is

When it does calm down

You don't

Take advantage of it, do you?

You're just like

You know, I'll watch YouTube

This week

I watched the Alien Earth

Oh, mate

I haven't watched it yet

I need to watch it

Oh, God, that's so good

Yeah, yeah, yeah

If you like Alien

And you've not seen Alien Earth

Just go and watch that

We went on a date, didn't we?

You and I

To watch Alien

We did

That was so good

Yeah, yeah

That was Romulus, wasn't it?

Yeah

At the IMAX

Yeah

The IMAX

We need to do that again

I love that

I love watching

Like, stuff like that

At the IMAX

It's so good

We watched

Doom, that was good

Oh, Doom was good

This will be another Doom, won't they?

Yeah, we could do that one

Yeah, I liked that

I did all that

Do you know the thing

That I love about Alien Earth as well?

I'm not going to spoil it for anybody

But it's

So when you get to the end

Of each episode

They play

Bangin' music tracks

Wicked

First one was Judas Priest

Oh, really?

I think

Oh, no, was it Judas Priest?

Anyway, they play like

Just massive

Tracks at the end of each one

And they're just like

Oh, that's

Oh, that's a

So I don't know

Who's choosing the music

For it

Because it's weird

All the way through the music

It's very

Very alien

Very atmospheric

It kind of just appears

There's a lot of

Like

Similarities to the original

Yeah, it nods to it

Yeah, loads and loads of that

But then the tracks

That they play at the end

Are not

They're of their time

But they're just like

They know their audience

Yeah, yeah, yeah

Absolutely know their audience

I was going to say

I thought you were going to say

At the end of each episode

They're a bit like Thundercats

Where they say

Don't do drugs, kids

Oh, Thundercats

Thundercats were great

Yeah, Thundercats

A-team

A-team did that as well, didn't they?

I don't know

It got to the end of the episode

And there was like a message

Like a moral of the story

I don't like morals

Yeah, yeah

Don't kill people, people

Don't kill people

See, the last one I remember

Of that was

Be kind to your mum

Those sort of things

Oh, Grange Hill

Yeah, yeah, yeah

And they had

I've forgotten the guy's name

They had the kid's name

Who did

The symbolic kid that did drugs

Yes

And then they had him going

Oh, don't do drugs

Yeah

And then they had the song

They had the song, didn't they?

Yeah, yeah

Yeah, that was

Don't do drugs

Yeah, it was

That's what the song was called

I think

Don't do drugs

Yeah

This week

It's about Sepultura

What's that?

That's good

Five minutes

That's good going

We're in

Five minutes

And then we intro

What we're doing

That's good

So you're Chris

I'm Chris

I'm Marty DeBergey

Yeah, Neil

Riffology.co

There's the website

Yeah

Look at the accompanying blog

To this podcast

Search for it

It's mega

It's absolutely awesome

It's like you look at it and go

It's interesting

It's like the most incredible thing

It's just the most incredible thing ever

It's like

What would President Trump would say

This is the best blog ever

What people say

I'm sure that's what he would say, isn't it?

Yeah, yeah, yeah

People would

People told me

Yeah, I can't do accents

People

People, people, people

It's very good

I am

Because I'd not heard this album ever

Yeah

This is slightly before your time

Yeah, this is like

Because this was 89

Yeah

Yeah, this would have been

If I had listened to this in 89

Would it have been 8?

Yeah

Would it be 8 or 7

Or one of those numbers

And I would have gone

Oh no

Oh no

This is shit

And I didn't have the audible palette for this

Yeah, so this for me was like

Proper full on life changing

So 89

How old were you?

Let's look at the numbers

I would have been 15

Yeah, so it's that 13, 14, 15 bit

Bang smack

So like I was

I was absolutely in love with

Like Metallica's like

Ride the Lightning

That was from 84

Master of Puppets

It's like Slayer's first couple of records

Like Wasp as well

And Judas Priest as

You know

And Iron Maiden

Yeah, yeah, yeah

There's a bunch of that kind of stuff

And then there was some like

Big heavy thrice

I loved this time

I loved Carcass

Yes

At this time as well

So that kind of stuff

So this would have been early Carcass, right?

Oh yeah, yeah, yeah

The kind of really kind of

You know, grungy

Yeah

Kind of, you know, gory stuff

And kind of early Napalm as well

But this came out

And I remember

Again on tape

So this is like

At this point in time

For me

Life was

Cassette tapes

Pretty much

Some people

You would have had some

Some CDs

But this was mostly

Some vinyl

If you were

Like you might

I remember

You would ask for vinyl

As like a Christmas present

Or whatever

But vinyl was expensive

So what you'd do

Is you'd go and get

Your cassette tapes

From the paper shop

And then you'd go

And wait for someone to get it

And then you'd record it

Or tape it

Or like for this one

For me

It was tape trading

So you would

There were a few

Like really renowned

Tape traders

So you would

You would like

Parcel up like a

Package of like

Six C90s

Post them off

To the tape trader

With your list of

Tapes

And then

What you would get back

Is they would take

One of the tapes

For themselves

And then they would

Fill the others

With stuff

And post them back to you

And then

And then you would

You would get that

And then they would

Send you like their list

Or they'd say

Oh can I have

Sometimes what you

Would get back

Is they would send you

Like four or five tapes

Like a wish list

Yeah they'd ask for

For you to put stuff

On there

And then you would

You would send them back

Yeah

And my friend

Got this

Obviously none of the

It was just all

Like handwritten

So none of the artwork

Or any of

Any of that

But I remember

Listening to

To this album

And just being

Floored by it

Just the

I mean the production

I mean like listening

Back to it now

You kind of think

The production's not

Like super mega

Right

Compared to

You know

Like I guess

A modern metal

Of its era

Of the day

This was

It was

There was something

Going on

It was you know

If you

If you want to

Kind of see

Like if you go

And listen to

A creator record

Of a similar time

They didn't

And a lot of

The thrash

Albums

They were like

Uber thin

Yeah

Yeah

Yeah

Yeah

The drums

Would sound

You know

Particularly nasty

I would say

For a lot of

A lot of albums

Around this time

You know

Really poor

Production quality

And then

This

This came through

And it's

It's phenomenal

This is

Mori Sound Studios

Scott Burns

Scott Burns

History is really

Interesting

So I was talking

About creator

Scott Burns

He was a

Computer engineer

He listened to

He loved this music

Listened to

Bands like

Creator

And just

Why are they

Making them

Sound so terrible

And then

Got involved

With the

Two brothers

That owned

Or started

Mori Sound Studios

Yeah

Got involved

With them

Built an

Amazing

Acoustic space

Realised for

Kind of heavy

Music

That the drum

Sound was

Like critical

You needed to

Get the drums

To cut through

The thick

Heavy guitars

And

Figured out

How to get

Triggering

Working

So this

Album

I can't remember

Many before

But this album

Will have been

Triggered

Yeah

Which for

1989 is

Phenomenal

Right

So you know

Being able to

Use

Computer triggering

Yeah

To get the

But the drum

Sound on

Here I

Think is

I mean

Underpins

Sepultura

Don't work

Without

If you listen

To their

As the albums

Go on

Past this

That tribal

Drumming

Just gets

Bigger and

Bigger and

Better and

Better I

Think

And I

Think you

Like roots

Don't you

I do

Yeah

But again

That record

To me

Kind of

Goes really

Tribal

Doesn't it

The percussion

Through that

Record

Yeah

Everything

Extraordinary

But that

Stuff

That doesn't

Work

Without

You have

To have

That really

Kind of

Amazing

Drum

Sound

But it

Started here

For me

It started

I think

And did you

Say that there

Were kind of

Like triggers

They were like

Drum triggers

Yeah

I mean that's

Just incredible

I don't know

In the

89

Yeah

And drum

Triggers

Yeah

Unbelievable

It's bonkers

Isn't it

Yeah

So drum

Triggers

Are

So on your

Drum kick

You've got

Kick

Ordinarily

You've got

Your kick

Drum

Which is

Your kind

Of like

And then

You've got

Your snare

Drum

Which is

Like your

Crack

That kind

Of sound

And then

You've got

Your toms

Which are

Like the

And the

And you

Get lower

Ones

And then

You've got

The hi-hats

Which are

Like the

Sound

And then

You've got

The cymbals

Which is

Like

See

So someone

Somewhere

Will sample

All of those

Sounds

I just

Did

And turn

Those

Into a

Drum kit

Yeah

If they

Wanted to

If they

Were so

Like into

Our podcast

And so

They could

Take all

Those little

Sounds

I just

Made

Yeah

All those

And they

Could turn

Them into

A Chris

Drum kit

And when

They hit

A key

On a

On a

Keyboard

Or a

Or a

Electric

Drum kit

Or something

Like that

Rather than

Playing an

Acoustic

Sound

It would

Play one

Of those

Sounds

And that's

That's what

Triggering

Is

So you'd

Sample

Effectively

Like a

Kick drum

A snare drum

You know

Separately

As a

Sound

And then

And then

You'd find

A way

To trigger

That sound

By

Usually

Something

Called

MIDI

Like some

Some sort

Like a

Keyboard

Or a

Pad

Of some

Description

And then

You'd

Hit that

And then

It would

Tell

The thing

The computer

Somewhere

To turn

That sound

On

And then

Turn it

Off

Again

And then

You hit it

Again

And then it

Comes through

Again

And it

Turns off

And

That technology

Wasn't really

A thing

Back in

1989

It makes

You wonder

How they

How they

Did it

But yeah

Phenomenal

I think

Like I say

Scott Burns

Was a

Computer engineer

And the

Brothers were

Acoustics

And

The only

Thing I can

Think of

Is that

About that

Time

Obviously

Was it

The Roland

MPC

The sampler

Yeah

So it would

Have been

Recording the

Kits

Into like

Sample libraries

On one of

Those things

And using

That to

Trigger the

Sound

So you

Hit the

Pads

I have no

Idea how

Yeah

Absolutely

No idea

How they

Did it

But I'm

Sure

There's some

Really interesting

Documentaries

And there's

A book

About Scott

Burns

Which I

Have bought

Myself

I've not

Read it

Yet

But I've

Got a

Copy

At home

So maybe

It goes

Into it

More in

There

So it

Was very

Important

To make

Just a

Killer

Record

And you

Think

I think

You can

Sense

That

Desperation

In the

Performance

Of that

Record

And

And I

Love it

I love

That the

Record

That we

Captured

That on

The album

You know

So I

Think

It's

Timeless

And

The crazy

Thing about

It

Is like

How

Relevant

Those songs

Are today

If you're

Talking about

Beneath the

Remains

Which is an

Anti-war

Song

You know

If you think

If you think

About what's

Going on

In Europe

Right now

In Ukraine

That song

Is all

About that

It's

You know

Who has

Won

Who has

Died

Beneath the

Remains

That's it

Man

You know

It's like

So it's

Crazy

30 years

Later

Those lyrics

Are more

Relevant

Now than

They

Even

Before

You know

They're more

Important

Now than

They were

I think

That makes

A little

Special

To

Makes

A little

Cooler

And it's

Just fun

To play

It's all

Tuned to

E standard

That was

Before we

Start

Fucking

With

Tunings

But yeah

It was

Revolutionary

This wasn't

Just like

You know

Turn the

Compression

Up

You know

There was

Some

There was

A lot

Of

Clever

Tech

To

Make

These

Albums

Sound

Like

This

But

The

Morisand

Studio

Like

Was

The

Epicenter

Of

This

Kind

Of

Extreme

Metal

Yeah

Community

It was

An absolute

Scene

And you

Could hear

It

The music

Went from

And absolutely

Was part of

The success

I think

You know

The production

Of those

Albums

Just suddenly

Went up

From

Because of

Morisand

Because of

Morisand

And because

Of

Scott Burns

Yeah

Where was

That

Where was

Morisand

It was in

Florida

Florida

Yeah

Yeah

So yeah

They

But it

Produced

This

Bizarre

Scene

I think

Where

Like Scott

Burns

Used to

Sleep

In the

Studio

He lived

Like an

Hour away

From

Morisand

Studios

So he

Would

Often

When they

Were recording

And working

On an

Album

He'd

Often

Just sleep

On the

Studio

Floor

Yeah

Yeah

Yeah

And

This

Record

Particularly

Sepultura

Was

Sao

Paolo

In

Brazil

So they

Were

Nowhere

Near

No

This

Community

And

Their

Music

Was

Their

Music

Was

Tape

Traded

It

Wasn't

Yeah

But you

Couldn't

Go and buy

Sepultura

Album

That's not

True

You could

Buy

Sepultura

Album

But they

What you

Needed to

Know where

To go

And you

You'd

Normally

Have

To

Get

One

I

Remember

Schizophrenia

A friend

Found a

Copy

Of it

Is that

The first

One

Yeah

So they

Did

A couple

Of

VPs

And stuff

But

I remember

Him finding

A copy

Of that

And

Somebody

Trying to

Snatch

It

Out of

His

Hand

As he

Was

Trying

To

Buy

It

There

Was

Like

Uber

Rare

Things

But

Yeah

Mostly

It was

It was

Kind of

You know

It was

Tape traded

It was

Fairly

Underground

Whereas

At that

Time

You know

The

Other

Extreme

Metal

Albums

Were in

Record

Stores

So it

Wasn't

Like

That

The

Whole

Scene

Wasn't

There

It

Was

Just

Like

Sepultura

Were

Out

Of

That

Does

That

Make

It

More

Because

It's

Because

It's

Scarce

Right

It's

It's

Scarce

Do

You

Think

Does

That

Make

It

More

Seen

As

Being

Like

A

Bit

Special

Yeah

When

When

You

Started

To

Listen

To

Them

And

They

I

Think

As

Well

It's

Like

Because

They

Were

Isolated

They

Were

Part

Of

The

That

Brazilian

Scene

And

The

Culture

So

That

Influenced

Them

And

They

Were

Incredibly

Tight

Band

I

Was

Was

One

That

Was

Cow

Hammer

One

Side

And

Discharge

On

The

Other

Side

And

I

Listened

To

That

Tape

Forever

It

Was

A

Use

Rick

I

Probably

You

Know

Use

That

Thing

To

Death

You

Know

Probably

Play

It

To

Death

And

Yeah

It

Was

Fun

You

Know

Tape

Training

With

Chuck

From

Death

Was

Great

And

Great

From

Morbid

Angel

And

Milly

From

Creator

You

You

Know

Dark

Angel

Possessed

We

Were

Involved

With

All

The

Bands

It

Is

Too

Much

What

I

Do

Now

I

I

Involved

With

All

New

Bands

Right

Now

Gate

Creeper

Necron

Carnation

You

Know

I

Still

Inside

Of

Me

I

49

But

I

Still

Have

The

Spirit

Of

15

Year

Old

Phoenix

And

You

I

Still

Look

For

Bands

Get

Excited

When

I

Hear

New

Stuff

I

Like

I

Like

To

Get

Their

T-shirts

I

Like

To

Wear

Them

I

Like

To

Support

You

On

The

Ground

Very

Much

The

Same

As

I

Was

I

Think

I'm

The

Same

Person

As

I

Was

When

I

Was

In

Those

Tape

Trazing

Days

Just

Just

The

Difference

Today

We

Have

The

Internet

But

They

Were

Playing

With

Other

Bands

In

Their

Scene

You

Know

So

So

That

Became

They

Didn't

Become

Watered

Down

They

Didn't

They

Weren't

Imitating

Yeah

I

Mean

They

Weren't

Imitating

Other

American

Bands

Or

Swedish

Death

Metal

Bands

They

Were

Kind

Of

Trying

To

Be

The

Best

Brazilian

Band

They

Were

It

Was

Their

Local

Scene

They

Were

Trying

To

Be

Brilliant

Yeah

And

Then

This

Record

Was

Recorded

Partly

In

Sao

Paolo

And

Then

Partly

In

Florida

In

Morisand

But

It's

Interesting

A lot

Of

People

Talk

About

This

Album

As

Being

Like

This

In

Between

State

Right

Where

I

Totally

Had

That

I

Like

When

I

Was

Listening

Through

It

It

Was

That

Thing

Of

Like

I

Don't

Know

Where

This

Fits

I

Know

How

It

Fits

In

The

Timeline

Of

All

The

Other

Bands

That

You

Know

Yeah

I

Kind

Of

Couldn't

I

Couldn't

See

It

It

Was

Like

A

Limbo

Album

It

Was

In

Between

Lots

Of

Other

Things

I

Mean

It

It's

Incredible

That's

Not

To

Say

It's

Not

Got

An

Identity

Because

It

Has

But

When

You've

Got

All

That

Other

Stuff

Going

On

Which

Which

Has

Very

Clearly

Got

That

Identity

Be it

Thrash

Be it

Death

Be it

You know

Extreme

Or

Like

You know

The

Lightest

Stuff

Or

Whatever

The

Classic

Rock

It

Doesn't

Fit

Solely

Into

Any

Of

Those

Pigeon

I

Gotta

Tell

You

That

The

Era

In

Metal

Was

Great

You

Had

Entombed

The

Carcass

God

Flash

Fuck

Land

It

Was

Like

The

Exciting

Era

Of

Metal

And

We

Rode

That

High

You

Know

And

Touring

And

The

Arise

Tour

Was

Great

Like

15

Month

Took

Us

Around

The

World

Indonesia

Australia

Russia

And

It

Was

Just

The

Beginning

Of

It

You

Know

And

So

Yeah

I

Look

Back

Really

Fun

Memories

Of

That

Time

And

That

Why

It

So

Cool

To

Play

These

Records

These

Nowadays

It

Kind

Of

Make

Us

Remember

Some

Of

The

Good

Times

We

Had

And

Appreciate

The

Record

It's

Got

Lovely

Bits

In

There

Where

There's

Like

Almost

Like

Acoustic

Melody

Yeah

And

It's

Savage

In

Places

And

It's

Really

Fast

In

Places

And

Then

It's

Really

Really

Heavy

And

Chuggy

And

Slow

And

It's

I like

The

Chuggy

Slow

Bits

The

Best

I have

To

Say

They're

Really

Good

At

That

Aren't

They

Yeah

And

It's

You know

It

Was

It

Was

A

Real

I

Think

It was

A real

Shift

For

Them

I

I

I

I

I

I

I

I

I

I

I

I

I think

I think

I think the band was super tight before that but I think he brought this ability to craft a song so I brought some melodies and some confidence to go and experiment a little but I think what he brought with him was this structure songcraft if you like.

Yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah. And the combination of that and Scott Burns is what lifted is what I think shaped this. Yes yeah. At that time in Brazil we all used to play five shows a year so it was very slow. And we were like really hungry. We want to do more. We knew we could do more. We knew we could be touring. So it was a bit of a frustration of building inside the band. But we knew like we could just keep working.

And things will eventually pick up. And I got a contract. You know I finally got it. We got a ticket to New York and you know drop a bunch of records in New York and one of them was Roadrunner and they called Monkey called us back and gave us a contract.

We were in cloud nine man you know like recording for the first time with a real label and you know with a producer you know so Scott came to Rio we did Beneath the Remain. We worked very hard on Beneath the Remain. I think it shows the maturity of the band.

Yeah I don't know. It's one of those albums that is just I think it's just just incredible from beginning to end. There's no part of this that just feels like an afterthought or a filler.

It's it's all crafted. It's been yeah yeah. It's just bonkers. It's just absolutely flat out from beginning to end. It's either like super fast or it's kind of melodic or it's like chuggy.

There's always something and there's always a change happening as well. There's like you know there's it never stays the same for very long and then you're kind of changing things up.

And again a lot of the death bands a lot of the thrash bands weren't doing that. No no no. And then this kind of because it was like Entombed did Left Hand Path which kind of begins and it has this big breakdown like in the middle of it which is like super cool.

But that's like the year after. Yeah yeah. This is a it's the breakdown is very much a Sepulchurri thing.

What can we put in a song to make it more exciting or you're gonna have a part where everything's gonna it's gonna go the crowd's gonna go crazy. You kind of waited. You kind of play the old song just waiting for that moment for that rip to arrive you know that breakdown.

So those were born for that necessity of an insane breakdown part in the middle of a song and we we live for that you know so it was kind of like the art of making songs that had those things in it. When we play live we lose our mind.

It is isn't it. I think you had like obituary who again they were kind of really heavy and slow and chuggy and I think it influenced them a little bit as well.

Yeah yeah yeah. So I think it's interesting as much as the other areas much as like thrash and death influenced Sepulchurri and you know as they progressed I think Sepulchurri changed the world a little bit.

But they were changing the band you know they were changing the bands around them.

People Remains in 89 and Arise in 91. They were created in the golden era and they captured that moment you know so play them now the people now that they kind of like you know live with the songs and they kind of the songs became part of their DNA actually.

The nostalgic feeling is very strong you know and you can help but you know and please kind of go back to that time and remember the era.

Interesting because when you were talking earlier about the tape trading idea.

Yeah.

This is almost like stylistic trading isn't it?

Yeah. Well you've talked about this in the past where it's like you know the music that you listen to influences the music you play.

Yeah.

Maybe not.

Like you're not stealing chord sequences or riffs or anything like that but it's just it lives in because you love it.

Yeah.

Oh that sounded really good.

Yeah yeah yeah and it'll come it'll come through in some other way.

It influences it influences you know how you how you do things.

so they absolutely absolutely did you know change the world around them you know and where they I mean I wonder if they'd have been bands like Gojira without Sepultura you know that the way that I mean they remind me huge I mean Gojira remind me massively of how I feel about Sepultura you know they I feel similar to to Gojira that I do about Sepultura.

That's interesting yeah.

Yeah that kind of I love that kind of tribal.

Yeah.

You know it's having that I think it's like a drum first record.

Yeah that's so interesting.

You know where it kind of is isn't it it's this but and you have to think that.

And that's Eagle right.

Yeah.

That's Eagle Cavalera.

Yeah.

And Max Cavalera being the kind of singer front man sort of.

Yeah.

Yeah for a while for those for the next like three three or four records.

Yeah.

And then they left to form Soulfly and Andreas because Andreas Kisser is still in Sepultura.

It's interesting I think Soulfly sounded more like Sepultura than Sepultura did for after that switch you know and it's obviously Max's voice.

If you think about the you know the brothers it's Max's voice.

Yeah.

Part of the songwriting was Max and then the drumming.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah.

And I think for me a lot of the yeah a lot of the signature style of Sepultura is in the drumming.

Yeah.

And like clearly in this record like Eagle's finding his place.

Yeah.

I mean the drumming in this record is excellent.

I mean it's absolutely exquisite.

It's excellent.

But Arise was even better.

Yeah.

And then Arise was the one afterwards.

Yeah.

And then Chaos AD was even better.

Yeah.

Yeah.

And Roots was even the drumming for me just gets like.

Yeah.

It just gets better and better and better.

Yeah.

So I think Chaos AD is a Rockfield one as well.

Oh no way.

Yeah.

Yeah.

I didn't know that was done in Rockfield.

I'm pretty sure Chaos AD is a Rockfield one.

Nick Brian engineered it I'm sure he did.

Did he?

Yeah.

He's done loads hasn't he?

Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah.

That Nick Brian he gets everywhere.

Yeah.

So just the link there for people going what where's his name come from?

Rockfield where's that come from?

We did the What's the Story Morning Glory a few weeks.

Well we did Live Forever and what's not Live Forever.

Definitely maybe.

And What's the Story is like a double kind of exploration a few weeks back.

And that was a Rockfield thing.

And I've been yeah I've got a soft spot for Rockfield.

Yeah.

You've played there haven't you as well.

Yeah.

I did a bit of soft there yeah.

You played the piano.

Yeah.

Done all the things.

Freddie's Piano.

Yeah.

Then he wrote Bohemian Rhapsody on and the Don't Know Back and Anger Piano.

Both lived there.

I didn't know that.

Yeah.

Coldplay's Trouble was recorded there.

Parachute's their first album.

Loads of good stuff.

Yeah I knew they did that there yeah yeah.

Yeah.

It's a cool place isn't it?

Yeah it is cool yeah.

We should do a studio tour.

That's what we should do.

Let's do that.

Should we just drive down to just knock on Nick?

Just go on the Nick.

Yeah yeah.

That's it.

He's not even there he's probably in Spain.

He's like Nick let's go just go out to all of them to go out of the road.

We're doing a thing.

Pull the kettle on.

Yeah.

I have to say the listening numbers for this now.

Yeah.

It's getting crazy isn't it?

It's dead good.

Yeah.

Thanks for listening.

Thank you for listening.

Even on our week off.

We did have a week off yeah.

And what was I going to say is that our listeners in Germany have gone up.

Yeah Germany and Spain.

And America.

So again if you're listening on iHeartRadio.

Hello.

Thank you very much.

Yeah hello.

That's good.

Yeah.

Tell your friends.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Leave us a review.

Yeah.

I've not looked.

You know ages ago we asked if people left us a review.

Yeah.

I haven't looked.

I mean for those of you that are not aware we're not that good at this.

So we do this stuff and then I forget because I'm like I forget about it completely.

And it's literally just occurred to me I wonder if anyone's left us a review.

And it doesn't but it doesn't the thing is that stuff goes into my spam.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Because you don't get it very often.

Yeah.

And I ignore all of the emails we get from Spotify.

Yeah.

Like because it's just I don't know it's just whinging right.

The same from Apple.

So I don't look.

Yeah.

So I better go and I better go and look.

But Lindsay.

Yeah.

Great friend of the show.

She she leaves comments and things sometimes.

Yeah.

Yeah.

And it might take me like two weeks to go and respond to it.

Because I don't it's only when I think oh I wonder I better check.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah.

But yeah.

Yeah.

It's not because we it's not because we don't like it.

It's just because we're not very good.

Yeah.

Yeah.

That's that's yeah.

Yeah.

It's it's far more about we're not very good.

Can we do you know what you when we decided we're going to do this album.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah.

I listen to this album a lot.

Yeah.

I still listen to this album now.

So this according to my last FM numbers.

Yeah.

I think I listen to this about 10 times a year.

Yeah.

Yeah.

So even now even not preparing for the show or anything else.

I just absolutely love this record.

Um but when you're listening to and you're thinking about uh you things to talk about

um it hit me that like the first half of this album is up there as being like one of the

best beginnings to like any albums goes starts with Beneath the Remains which is phenomenal.

Inner Self is one of my I think it's just incredible.

Rex really slow and kind of you know um yeah it's chuggy.

Yeah.

When it's incredible.

We'll see you next time.

We'll see you next time.

We'll see you next time.

We'll see you next time.

We'll see you next time.

We'll see you next time.

We'll see you next time.

We'll see you next time.

We'll see you next time.

We'll see you next time.

We'll see you next time.

We'll see you next time.

We'll see you next time.

We'll see you next time.

We'll see you next time.

We'll see you next time.

We'll see you next time.

We'll see you next time.

Walk on these third streets, with hate in my mind, feeling the scorn of the world.

I want to follow the rules, blame and lies, contradictions arise, blame and lies, contradictions arise.

Not the problem in my inner self, only I've got my inner self.

I want to change my way, it has to be this way.

I want to change my way, it has to be this way.

I live my life for myself, forget your filthy ways, blame and lies, contradictions arise, blame and lies, contradictions arise, blame and lies.

And lies, contradictions arise, and lies, contradictions arise.

We'll see you next time.

We'll see you next time.

We'll see you next time.

We'll see you next time.

We'll see you next time.

We'll see you next time.

We'll see you next time.

We'll see you next time.

Trained by turning, you think you will, but someday you fall and I'll be waiting.

That's all the insane men, you're here, personalized by women, our cancer and death.

That's all the insane men, you're here, personalized by women, our cancer and death.

That's all the insane men, you're here, personalized by women, our cancer and death.

That's all the insane men, you're here to be, you're here to be, you're here to be.

One of these first dreams, we'll be hating my mind.

Finish the corner of the world, I won't fall your rose.

We'll be right back.

We'll be right back.

We'll be right back.

We'll be right back.

We'll be right back.

We'll be right back.

We'll be right back.

We'll be right back.

We'll be right back.

We'll be right back.

We'll be right back.

We'll be right back.

We'll be right back.

We'll be right back.

I think, to me, Beneath The Remains is one of the most raw records ever made in metal in general.

And I believe I know why it's so raw.

It was because it was done at night.

That's a nocturnal record.

Nocturnal record ever since.

We couldn't record during the day.

There was a pop band in the studio during the day.

So our sessions was from midnight to seven.

Like, it's crazy.

I never heard of those hours in a studio for a band before.

It was the only thing available.

We wanted to record in the best Brazilian studio at the time.

And it was Nas Nuvens in Rio.

And that was all that was available.

It was that.

But because of that, just because it was nocturnal, man.

There's something about those graveyard shift hours filter right into the record, man.

You almost feel like the desperation of...

Also because I think it was our shot.

You know, we had this one shot.

It's like you're holding the dice and you're rolling the dice and you got this one fucking chance to make it a good one.

It was Roadrunner put all the chips on us.

They're believing in this band.

We had to make the best record we could make.

So, I was very inspired and very, just very thrilled, man.

And I think it shows on the songs.

I think the growth from Schizophrenia to Beneath The Remains is huge.

I think the band, we all took a step forward.

And then you go Stronger Than Hate.

Stronger Than Hate has got a little bit death.

It goes a bit deathy.

It's kind of thrashy and deathy, that one.

But I really like that.

Mass Hypnosis has got these kind of incredible breakdown bits in there.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Where you've got these phenomenal...

And like stuff that other bands were not...

No, exactly.

You were either thrash or you were hard.

Yeah.

But you had like...

Like Testament did a bit of this.

Alex Skolnick's guitar work is exquisite.

He wasn't scared to stick an acoustic guitar in a thrash record, you know, and do clever stuff.

But not like Sepultura did it.

No, exactly, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Like just, you know, thick in the middle of a track and it just kind of breaks into...

We'll be right back.

We'll be right back.

We'll be right back.

We'll be right back.

We'll be right back.

We'll be right back.

We'll be right back.

We'll be right back.

We'll be right back.

So, I'm a huge metal fan, Stu, no matter what.

You know, like, that never went away.

So, I think that's great.

I know that people say, oh, you got to grow out of that phase, but fuck that, I don't want to, you know, I don't want to grow out of that phase.

I'm a metal head for life.

so many other different people and things and all that sort of stuff so and i think there's a lot of

love for sepultura yeah they're a band that people rarely you don't kind of get this oh i hate them

no exactly yeah i mean it's that they are um yeah they're they're they're they're a special bunch i

think but the other thing is um like when you said there that the first half is such a powerful thing

we both like different parts of the of the record yeah that's which is really interesting because

the bits that i like i'm just going through mine now was a massive noses of course because you said

just said there you got to that one that was the and um slaves of pain and lobotomy which i think

that all those are later on in the record aren't they they are yeah slaves of pains quite fast i

think as well that's kind of quite um and then i like lobotomy yeah but that's some of the lead work

yeah i think it was that as well for me i think that is is yeah i think that's extraordinary

um and then um yeah and then like it ends with with primitive future as well which i don't know

again it's it's just one of these um albums i feel like sometimes i love albums because you end up with

like some some albums make tons of sense and they're just like you know i mean it's it's like

super thought thought through and like anything from steven wilson right it's like it's got this arc to it

normally and it's got it's you know like pink floyd or you know there are these albums that are like

connected from the beginning to the end yeah all been recorded you know when the first the first

bit of the first track is actually being recorded all of it's kind of planned right and then there are

albums that are not yeah where there are you know it's a collection of where the band were like if you

look at like appetite for destruction or yeah you know like i guess early metallica right where where

there's you know that they're they're songs that were written and then all put together and there

are songs like some of the megadeth records where they're like every song is recorded in a different

album yeah different studio yeah yeah yeah um you know this one for me is got it's it's got the same

like production qualities yeah but the songs all sound like the same tone yeah but structurally and

and the songs they're all really quite different you know in the way they run and the way they approach

things so like you don't get bored yeah you know it's kind of not an album that you um there's always

something interesting either happening or about to happen yes you know it switches and changes quite a lot

which i don't know i think always i'm trying to like as a 15 year old obviously i didn't really care

about any of that no you just thought oh that sounds really heavy and that sounds dead good and then you

know then i guess i mean what keeps you coming back i suppose isn't it you know those albums from that

time that so do you know like when this album do you know because certain albums i love in the same

way that you love this one i know it inside out yeah i know it track by track i know like when the track

neck the track ends i know what's coming next and all that sort of stuff and i kind of know that i

know the album in a really intricate and intimate way yeah do you have that with this oh god yeah yeah

yeah this this one you yeah this one i know really really well yeah yeah from uh um yeah it's weird

it's like the gap the gap in between the songs you know exactly yeah yeah yeah you know exactly what

where you are and yeah but it's like yeah i know exactly where i am in the album and where i am in the

track so it's kind of like i kind of visualize you know what i mean where i visualize where i

am in the in the album when especially when i'm listening to it in the car yeah um which is interesting

because i don't think young people now who are say 13 14 15 which is where they're creating their

identity and yeah or forming their identity should i say when a lot of it comes through music they won't

probably have that experience maybe in the same way but and i think actually the tape trading has a lot to do

with that because you can't skip them yeah yeah you could be right you can't skip them you have to

listen to the thing all the way through with the album with the because it's recorded verbatim isn't

it yeah yeah yeah because they were the tape i had with this had this on one side an obituary cause of

death yeah and it went into 45 minutes ah yeah because i remember having a bon jovi one it was two

bon jovi albums yeah yeah but because they didn't quite fit on the side yeah they cut halfway through a

song so like there were some albums like new jersey for example which my uncle made made on a tape for me

yeah i never heard the end of the album until later and then and then i bought it on cd and

it was like oh my god there's like three more songs on this thing whatever you know i can't remember i

just remember having that tape and i would i would play on one side then play on the other side then

play on one side then play on the other side um and i remember having that you're right it might not

have even been complete yeah yeah it might have just been like well i guess what somebody felt were

their favorite songs and that was the other interesting thing you wouldn't you wouldn't have seen the

art with the artworks really interesting yeah but you wouldn't have seen it like you you would have

no because because you're at the hand just a hand it would have just been handwritten and then if you

were lucky like this this one it said sepultura and then it would say it said uh brazil right um and

sometimes you would get like um uh what did i get for like there was one there was a one tape trader and i

i traded for a bunch of thrash um uh tapes yeah and he sent me again a bunch of local flyers yeah

yeah for the gigs that were around so you would see that as well so and that's what the artwork that's

the artwork i saw yeah and then it was only like i probably i don't know probably two years after three

maybe yeah probably two years after yeah this like 91 ish we would be out in record stores yeah yeah yeah and

then that's when i first saw the album artwork and those kind of things um but which is incredible when

you think about it like you know it's not like i hadn't seen like you there were record stores in ashby

where we went to school but it wouldn't have carried this stuff no no um but yeah i remember first seeing

this and bought the t-shirt yeah uh and just loved it because the album artwork for this they were both

by uh so so sepultura's beneath the remains yeah and obituaries cause of death uh were both by michael

whelan yeah and the story is fascinating so the story is that sepultura were in roadrunner yes and they're in

the red in the record company's office and they were shown a bunch of album artwork that they could

use yeah also it's almost like they had a a selection that they could choose a bunch of stuff that we've

bought and licensed wow so we've not had this can use we're not creating this for your album this is

this is like this is stock yeah this is well these were four and this i might get this mixed up but the

story i'm pretty sure michael whelan did these for uh like a uh a movie or something right okay it was

done for some for something else yeah it wasn't meant for this roadrunner then bought the rights

to use it as an album i see right okay but they bought loads of it so so yeah so they just almost

like bought the rights to use yeah so what they would do is they would go off and find artists who had

got cool artwork and then would license it and then we'd get it and then and then it was kind of like

hey here's what we've got choose yeah choose one right anyway sepultura chose um so i'm going to

show you now sepultura chose that one yeah oh really the obituary one with the big eye on it yeah so

they chose the artwork for cause of death now it's either igor or max i can't remember has like half a

tattoo and it's of that they started to have that tattoo be made of the big eye oh no and then and then

somebody at roadrunner yeah said no yeah yeah um that obituary better with obituaries album than yours

and then they gave them the um what was called nightmare in red yeah so uh so the the the eye one

is called tales oh god imagine that you've been so locked into this thing you get a tattoo of the

they were split the band they were livid absolutely livid over it but i have to say a lot as great as

the obituary album cover is yeah those two album covers i had them i had them as posters on my wall as

a both of them yeah yeah as a i know we're 16 17 year old i had them on my wall i had t-shirts of both of

those and they were like for me that's kind of the i just love them i just think they're so good this

so intricate the artwork is just phenomenal and just so perfect like that that like you know that kind of

um the nightmare in red yeah yeah for beneath the remains i mean how perfect is that for the album

yeah yeah yeah yeah that really is that that is the the cause of death album cover is brilliant yeah

but the nightmare in red is vibe yeah it fits the album so much better yeah um and yeah anyway so i i

i love i love the story behind it and yeah it kind of gives you a bit of an insight into what was going on

um but i i yeah i just think it's like phenomenal really really phenomenal i think um i think is it fact time

fact do you know because i did the blog um i uh it's it's um i will try and do fact but um i i did it in

in a way that was probably a little bit less facty so um so the i'll do it i'll do my best best facts

best fact so um released in 1989 um it was max cavallera andreas kisser um igor cavallera and paulo jr paolo

um i'm gonna hear paolo paolo yeah and the bit that i think is interesting is that andreas kisser gets

credited for songwriting whereas actually i think it was max and andreas i think the band did a lot of

songwriting but um in lots of articles what i read um it it kind of said uh it like officially tags andreas

kisser as uh songwriting and i'm not sure um was recorded recorded in a bunch of different uh places

um it was recorded in sao paulo and it was also recorded in morris sound studios that we've already

talked about um now morris sound studios was founded by jim and tom morris um but scott burns basically

used it as uh um a home so um he he there's a lovely quote from him where he says that there

was this general consensus that nobody who produced stuff like sepultura gave a shit about it no one

ever tried to make them sound good and at the time jim and tom were pioneers as far as doing drum

triggering and they invested money in pc electronics and figured out how to use that to make really good

recordings scott burns was a computer engineer no he joined them and then that's kind of where the uh

where the thing came from um is there's lots and lots of discussions with him where he talks about

it's just basically trial and error they just tried tons and tons of different things until they got

the thing they wanted the thing that worked um tons of uh stories about scott burns uh sleeping in the

studio but production wise i mean so he did 1988 in 1988 he did death's leprosy um then he did like

sepultura obituary atheist terrorizer um cancer deicide napalm death um there's a lovely bit from napalm

death when they talked about um doing it was for harmony corruption which is kind of a bit of a death

metal record from those that kind of first switch away from kind of grind and over to death um it's

fascinating i was reading um shane embry's biography and he was saying like one of the highlights of his

life was going to morris sound studios and meeting scott burns because i mean they were just kids from

birmingham yeah and and um it's like it's a bit like going to um you know the studio that the um your

favorite albums and bands were you know were recorded yeah yeah but like going to rockfield

yeah i'm recording there um so a huge a huge deal the rockfield um uh rockfield studio um

a big part of that that scott puts down to is getting the drum sound right yeah which i think is the

for me that kind of underpins this album massively um uh the album itself um the tracks aren't too short

so the kind of average like five minutes yeah five minutes which i think is um an appropriate length

for a song slightly slightly too long slightly on the on the long side but absolutely mega

um the big single was in herself there was an mtv uh video as well which is like for um for extreme

metal and and kind of this stuff it wasn't often used they didn't often um i didn't often see that

um there's been a bunch of different versions of it although i'm quite pleased to say you can still get

the original yeah yeah so was released in 89 roadrunner um then there was a european pressing uh it

wasn't released oh you know i've just only just realized it wasn't released on cd initially it was

released on on cassette and vinyl set and vinyl first 89 91 it got a cd and then in 2020 this was repressed

right on vinyl that's the version i've got now right yeah um uh it did not have uh you know the parental

guidance yes not on it no didn't have that which i think is really interesting yeah um they toured with

uh cause obviously called uh obituary on the same label yes so they they went off and did uh uh uh did

touring um there's another bit down here where it talks about um yeah so i'm going to do a quick fact

recap um so released april 7th 1989 recorded in nas newvin studio rio de janeiro and morris sound um

length 4148 which is an appropriate length that is the appropriate length i like that as well um

album before was schizophrenia 1987 production on that was shocking um and then and then they're

a phenomenal band i think for production because then you've got beneath the remains this was the

first one that i fell in love with and then arise yeah the one i stepped up i think that was the best

record that they've done and then uh and then they um yeah they they develop then into this um but the

production just gets better and and the percussion just gets better it's like like i guess um

my take they went out of my taste a little bit but the production and the and the uh the songs on

those albums afterwards just i mean utterly incredible um uh the album's budget was eight thousand dollars

wow which is not much is it no not much at all uh which yeah um scott burns fee allegedly uh was two

thousand dollars right yeah uh which was super low yeah and the quotes are because he really wanted to

work with a brazilian band yeah yeah and he was really really curious um yeah really really curious about

them um they were seen as being a black metal kind of band right that's interesting because the black

metal you normally associate with european bands yeah um album was released on april 7th 89 it reached

number nine on the uk indie charts yeah um which yeah which was pretty pretty cool we've already talked

about the video in a self was on mtv which played on headbangers ball that's kind of what that inner self

that kind of chuggy heavy but that's the one that kind of really kind of uh pushed them through a

little bit i think um and then and that's that's kind of it for facts really there's there's like you

know we talked about there's a bunch of uh reissues and stuff um the band eventually broke up which

you don't want to go into um but it it's interesting they they don't feel any more like my sepultura

yes this this is sepultura to me and then but who are max and igor touring as then now because they

said they still did stuff didn't they so there was a soul flight and then there was a max cavallera

there was the cavallera conspiracy yeah yeah um and then they've just redone uh bestial devastations

and schizophrenia yeah yeah and then because a couple of the interviews that we've put for this one are

from a an event where they toured live they toured beneath the remains and arise yeah it's like a live

thing it's like a celebration of that word but that wasn't sepultura itself was it it's super

weird yeah it's a bit like entombed like entombed aren't entombed anymore either or wishbone ash

yeah it's like two different wishbone ashes yeah it's like oh i don't know what but it's interesting

to me i think that timeline like if you if you follow this the timeline through to the point that max and

igor uh leave sepultura yeah yeah and then soul flight appears yeah that is that's the band that sound more like

sepultura to me and sepultura your sepultura yeah then sepultura changed into like something slightly

that's still awesome i mean it's not like they're they you know were terrible they were great but i've

seen them live and i've seen them live uh way back then and they were great and i've seen them live

um uh with just andrea's kisser and without the cavalera yeah yeah yeah um but and they were great in

both both cases and as much as i'm kind of saying that the for me a lot of that dna of sepultura was

was igor's yes uh percussion yeah um they're still epic today and they're still there today so that that

that dna that um um style if you like you're still there but it's not quite yeah the same

yeah you know it's not quite the the same as it as it was for me um but yeah it's fascinating i think

the way that progresses and then and then soul fly yeah um you know how that how that kind of came about

but but yeah um yeah it's really really interesting album this one and i think if you've not heard it

if you're too young to have heard it this this one um yeah it's definitely if you liked that kind of

era yeah or where this went kind of i guess if you liked where death metal

went around this time that kind of florida scene yeah for me this is this is one of uh you know if you

imagine like a uh like a a table with legs right this is this is this album is one of those yeah

it's one of the legs you know if you think about like scott burns yeah and morris i yeah it's important

beneath the remains is a i think is a part of that yeah um i don't think that scene would have been

anywhere as no no big without the like the influence of uh you know of uh of sepultura yeah i just i mean

not that they were bigger than any of the bands i don't think they were but it's like you said it's

that influence importance thing isn't it yeah yeah it definitely it definitely did something it

mixed it it mixed a gene pool up a lot i think absolutely it's like the um the swedish death scene

as well yeah i mean there's there there's all these kind of scenes that happen and when they happen

around the same time sometimes they're totally isolated yeah yeah um and and i think there was a

bunch of stuff like if you it's fascinating you're going to listen to the tone of the guitar tone

of the swedish death scene and that was the the um heavy metal yeah yeah just with um i saw a lovely

article which talked about the um exquisite detail of how to get that tone and it had to get that tone

yeah and you literally wind everything up to the max that's great and i just think it's just like but

you get this when you do that with that pedal yeah you said you get it yeah you sound you get that buzz

source swedish death metal sound um and so you got that stuff that was going on but then you'd got um

you've got sepultura with this like just like perfect percussion sound and i think that's what yeah yeah

yeah yeah yeah yeah it's but it sounds menacing it's got this dark toned it's the thick dark thick

tone to the like black sabbath yeah yeah yeah like that it's got that kind of which reflects the album

art better than the other one doesn't it that's the thing yeah that's when you when you just said that

then i just had the image of that album in my head going yeah it is it's more skull and it's way

more in keeping i remember wearing it i remember wearing that to school and yeah and like you know

you're not allowed to wear that what yeah um but there there is a um yeah there's it is it's like

some bands do that really like i think slipknot do that i know slipknot get a lot of grief in the in

the press and stuff but then they oh the slipknot were definitely like a follow-on of this thing they

there was an inspiration of this in slipknot yeah sure 100% like the first band i think that did this

really well with slayer yeah where they it's got this kind of menacing like quite scary yeah

kind of tone it's a horror thing isn't it yeah yeah yeah it's like watching a horror movie it's not like

you know you're like a jump scare it's like alien it's just about to come you know i really want to

watch that now yeah um and then you so you you know what i mean you have that where where there's this

um this menacing undertone to it and it's a bit scary it has a bit you know yeah yeah i'm not really

sure about this kind of thing and it's like a slayer with the first band that did that to me

and but this does it too this has got that yeah yeah yeah like it's a bit unusual yeah and it's a bit

you know it's not just following on it's not like no it's not just a metallica yeah you know i mean

chuggy chuggy chuggy chuggy yes you know what i mean chuggy chuggy it's not that it's got this like

do you know what i mean i'm gonna wait till you're asleep and then i'm gonna cut your toes off

do you know what i mean yeah that's what it's got that yeah that's really strange you just said

that i had a nightmare about that once did you yeah i'm going to talk to you about that off air

yeah yeah yeah one of my favorite bits one of my favorite movies is lock stock and two smoking

barrels yeah i i love it if if um for our american colleagues uh if you've not seen lock stock and two

smoking barrels uh it's it's a guy richie movie but when there's no budget yeah it's kind of low

low low rent uh thing um but there's a brilliant bit in there where he's got these two lads from

liverpool who've come down to london and he's giving them this job right but we want them to break into a

manor house and go and steal whatever they can get but he wants these guns out of the gun cabinet

and that's their job so that in they go and there's this old couple in the in the manor house

uh and and they kind of get them and and tie them up and then the camera follows one of them going

through the gun cabinets yeah yeah and when he comes back he's got this old man and he's setting fire to his

toes he's got like but then i love what i love about the scene is um paddy could probably tell us why this

is so good but like he's he's like sitting there and then the two guys that are broken and now start

fighting with each other yeah i remember this video why do you have to burn everybody's toes

and said i'm trying to make him talk yeah why

and it's just i i don't know there's just something exquisite about that

i love movies don't you like me i yeah yeah i do yeah i love i absolutely love and i love those kind of

offbeat you know just slightly off yeah off the beaten path i love those lock stock and two

smoking barrels you should totally if you've not seen it if you've not watched it this month yeah

the world would be a better place if everyone watched that i think that's it well before we hit

record we're talking about you know what's going to sort the world out because everything's a big

mess and maybe it's watching lock stock every week it is an alien an alien yeah yeah love alien yeah

i i i i have i went through when i was a kid someone's a kid when i was a teenager i loved

watching movies like just i i think just that thing that takes you away from reality for yeah and i i

loved it i just it just yeah i wasn't i was never particularly analytical about movies but i i just

loved their ability to take me away and and um and i lost a bit of that i think yeah probably through my

30s and 40s yeah yeah yeah yeah the last probably two or three years i'm looking forward to getting

that back because i know exactly what you're talking about i've fallen back in love with it yeah again

and it's just this ability for someone to lift me up and take me on a a journey yeah and it and it's

interesting it's like um i love alien yeah just as much as i love spinal tap yeah and for the same

reason things they're just they're just like storytelling the the arc the yeah the journey you

go on yeah it is and i love i love something that will make me like a bit scared or a bit sad or

something that's funny yeah yeah yeah i don't know there's just these there's just this like ability

to yeah yeah yeah you know to just kind of pick you up and take you out of the world i'm so excited

about a new spinal tap yeah yeah the clips look great yeah um and it's got elton john in it yeah

i've not seen anything yet really i've not seen anything no oh it's so it's got elton john stonehenge

yeah there are so few movies that can do that what what i mean how old spinal tap yeah this is it

isn't it yeah yeah it's so much fun it's so much fun and just some stat like standards yeah like songs

are standards they're a bit there are parts of that film which are just standards of comedy i i yeah

i i we still quote it now we still so it's a weird so we're like doing you know going out to a gig and

we got like we get we get inevitably wherever we go we get lost on the way um and everyone's like yeah

rock and roll yeah you did that when we were invented we were all carrying boxes and we're in that

everywhere was black yeah i just remember every like corridor we went down was black

and then like dan was in the front and dan was like oh the door's locked yeah and then you tried

another door and we opened another door and you went rock and roll and it was just like

everyone knew what that meant doesn't get any more perfect and then that story where we

it was like two o'clock in the afternoon we were just walking around these black like matte black like

like you know um night club-esque it wasn't it was just like yeah black painted corridors like imagine

a hospital with black matte black painted corridors yeah and then we just all walked out of this door

and we were on a there was like a set like a drum and bass set happening we all just walked out oh

and then walked slowly back in again it's mad yeah i've got one better okay i've got one better this is

ultimate rock and roll this is so this is uh festival number six yeah um in port merion yeah

so they took over port merion for a weekend i think it only happened for maybe four or four or five years

maybe like that um and they you know they took over port merion and they turned the village or the town

whatever it is into like a festival site and there's this beautiful part if you've if you've been to

port merion yeah yeah it's beautiful yeah it's incredible so weird it's like a fantasy place

yeah it's like i say it's like a hobbit village yeah yeah yeah yeah and there's a bit of it where

it just goes into woodland yeah and up sort of up to the right on the cliffs yeah and i decided with

my auntie karen to go for a walk in these woods um chris's auntie karen is legendary yeah you don't go

anywhere you don't go anywhere without and we had to be on stage starting at either three or half past

three in the afternoon something like that yeah and it was this kind of beautiful like pots like

pepper pot kind of like lighthouse thing yeah um it's i say it's so surreal like you know we went on

there and it was like we're on three different levels yeah um and and like i was looking around

the crowd we were looking down on the crowd and then open then all the different and then like

look to the left and that johnny vegas is stood there watching us and the pictures from there i think

sal did them and yeah yeah they were great incredible really really crazy but anyway i was quite

i could it fine like making it to the stage and the reason for this was because when we got into

the woods we got so far in yeah and then got totally lost so we found our place to a cliff like cliffside

path and then people sat there and i felt like i was at the opening scene of monkey island secret of

monkey island during the day and that's what that felt like and i thought i better i better start you

know we're getting there now i better walk back yeah and proceeded to get totally lost in the woods like

like like like like like like lost my bearings yeah i lost foot no signal phones out but whatever

and honestly i ran i ran like through the woods found a way somewhere um and then ended up on the

stage plugging my things in about a minute or two after we were supposed to start and all the lads going

where have you been yeah yeah and i went rock and roll

oh yeah that was like bad that was that was well that's the worst that's the worst that's happened

i think the thing is though you know the the spinal tap

it quite clearly was written by somebody that has been and done those things yeah yeah because that's just

the way it is yeah it's just the way it's a beautiful bit where they stood behind around like the memorial

singing with the fingers and they just can't get it oh it's so good

yeah no i i there's not many movies that do that bill and ted i still like for that a bit more slapstick

but yeah yeah there's just something like so dry about spinal tap yeah where it's not

comedy do you know what i mean it's not like no one's telling jokes no no one's trying to make you

yeah yeah i mean that's the christopher guesting isn't it yeah it's this pure that situation

yeah yeah and it's just the absurdity yeah i mean the bit where the bit where the stonehenge thing is

tiny yeah so how many times people must do that yeah yeah yeah stonehenge all every time yeah

it's good um i don't know what we're doing a podcast sorry we digressed well we're going to be going

in an hour that's good that's very good with the inter when the with the interviews and the music this

will be a two-hour job this one what i was going to say is i had a plan for next week's oh show yeah

i was going to bring i've got your 1990s cd wallet yeah from your car massive in it in my house yeah and

i thought all this week yeah it's been on my desk yeah yeah i think it's gonna be dead good i'm gonna

take it in for chris yeah i'm gonna give it to him and then chris can choose yeah which one we're gonna

do oh and it's still on my desk next week we will do that so shall we do you shall we um play a music

yeah and then maybe we'll think about what we do next i've got an idea oh which i'll voice while we're

playing the music yeah and then and then we'll see and then we'll see whether you like the idea or not

i don't you know what i'm let's just do it you haven't got the idea yet you might not like it

you've never had have you ever had a bad idea we've never had a bad idea

have we no no they've all been brilliant good ideas we did good

so

so

i shall repeat myself

so

so

so

so

so

so

so

so

so

so

so

so

so

so

so

so

i'm

so

so

so

i'm

so

so

i'm

so

i'm

so

i'm

so

i'm

i'm

so

i'm

so

i'm

so

I stand upon the free man, my face I have free him

I don't know what might have lost, I won't be lost anymore

I stand upon the free man, my face I have free him

I stand upon the free man, my face I have social equality

To live again won't be a lie

I stand upon the free man, my face I stand upon the free man, my face I have free him

I stand upon the free man, my face I have free him

I stand upon the free man, my face I have free him

What are we doing then?

We're back!

Because my idea, I said my idea and you were very supportive and went oh!

Was I supportive?

Yeah you were quiet and then you told me why it was a crap idea and I agreed and went oh

yeah you're probably right actually, so we won't even tell what the idea was

I was going to say, I was going to go with the flow that this was your idea

Oh really?

Yeah I was going to get this idea, so what we decided to do is to do Soulfly

Yes

Next

Yeah yeah yeah

Because I think it, I think, I think it

Which was kind of related to my idea

Well you wanted to do Arise

Yes

I have to be, Arise I had on CD

Yeah

Which I have found in the garage

Is that how you say, that's how you'd be posted

So I found it in the garage and it reminded me like how much I listened to that record

You know there are some records that you listen to and you're like that's a great record

Yeah yeah yeah

And you listen to a bit

Yeah

And like Hand Justice for All was like that

I liked Hand Justice for All, I had it on tape, I listened to it on the bus into college

But it had a relatively short shelf life for me, probably a year

Yeah yeah yeah

And then it kind of went, whereas Beneath The Remains and Arise

Yeah, they were just stapled

Oh yes, absolutely stapled, yeah

Every time you got like, if you know, every, when I got a car

Yeah

They would have been in there

Yeah yeah yeah

Without shadow of a doubt, right, and I'd have listened to it

So you wanted to do that and I kind of thought that's dead good, it's such a good album

But

Yeah

The story

You let me down really nicely

The story is basically the same as this one

Yes yeah yeah

There's not a great, it's like, you know, same people

You said, rubbish idea in the nicest possible way

I've had training

So we're going to go for Soulfly

But I thought Soulfly

Yeah yeah yeah

Soulfly is actually like what you meant to say

Yeah

Training 101

Isn't it

Yeah yeah yeah

That's where you, because it is that, for me, that is like the next step

Yeah

Not necessarily the next album

No

But it's the next step

But it's the next step

Yeah yeah yeah

And we could, I, I, I, it's going to be really cool

Because I've not listened to that record

Yeah yeah yeah

In a long time

And I'm quite looking forward to going back and listening to it

Because at the time I remember loving it

Yeah yeah yeah

But it didn't stick with me quite in the same way as this

Yeah yeah yeah yeah

Yeah you see, I remember it coming out and going, oh

Yeah yeah yeah

There's, there's, there's the next chapter

In fact, for me, I don't, again, it's time again

So I'm not very good at time

You're terrible at the time

Yeah yeah yeah

But it, for me, it's like, that's the precursor for Slipknot

You know, the Soulfly energy

The energy of that, not necessarily style or what they're playing

But the energy of that music

Yeah

Almost like paved the way for what Slipknot became

It was, yeah, I remember listening to Soulfly and it was

I mean, it was huge at the time

Yeah yeah yeah

But yeah, I, that was an album that was

You're right, it was an album that was just like, oh

That's, you know, there's something bigger here

Yeah yeah yeah

Yeah, looking forward to that, I think it's good

And then the week after that

That's where we'll do the CD thing

We are doing your CD flap thing

Yeah yeah yeah

Your CD flap holder

Yeah

But there's, there's some, there's some bonkers stuff in there

Yeah yeah yeah

In your, in your box of flaps

My kids were like, what's in that, Dad?

And I was like, oh, and that's Chris's CD box